Revelation Unfolding/Program 2

Introduction

Ankerberg Welcome to our program. My guest is Dr. Jimmy DeYoung, who has lived in Jerusalem since 1993, and has interviewed every prime minister of Israel since that time. And today we’re going to start with an interview from the current prime minister of Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu. Why? Because the world is starting to pull its support away from Israel. It’s abandoning Israel for different reasons. And what I want you to hear are the Israeli governmental leaders telling you why. And, first of all, we’re going to talk about the rise of militant Islamic fundamentalism in the Middle East. Here are the words from Benjamin Netanyahu. Listen.

Benjamin Netanyahu: There is an opposing force that has been simmering for centuries and has been unleashed, first in the late 70s, in late 1979 in Iran, and then a decade later in Afghanistan, and these are the latent forces of militant Islam. Latent because they have been brewing for centuries under the surface with an animus towards the very freedoms that I described, with an attempt to regiment society according to a very doctrinaire conception of life under what is called a pristine view of Islam. Obviously there are two strains in this dogma, the militant Sunnis and the militant Shiites. One burst out in Iran, the militant Shiites in ’79, and a decade later the victory of the Mujahedin heralded the rise of al Qaeda.

If you look at what has happened politically to the world, you see a clear trajectory of the rise of militant Islam. You see it not only taking over countries, which it has, but also extending its sway over many people in a very large continuum of the Muslims. Obviously they haven’t been able to take over the majority, and even the minority is small, but the minority of a very, very large majority is troubling in itself. But their goals are unlimited. Whatever their successes so far, they don’t intend to stop. They continue. They’ve been competing with each other, each of these militant strains: who will produce the greater spectacular, the more spectacular successes for the creed.

Ankerberg: Jimmy, Benjamin Netanyahu just talked about the rise of militant Islam taking over many countries and a large number of people in the Middle East. What I’d like you to do is, how does this all fit into the big picture of what the Old Testament prophets warned is coming in the future?

DeYoung: Well, John, the word Islam is not actually used anyplace in the Word of God. Any of the prophetic passages would not refer directly to Islam. But when you look at all the players that will be involved in the last days, their lowest common denominator is the Islamic faith. And of course the radical aspect of that Islamic faith is taking control of every one of those countries. You’d have to go back to the book of Ezekiel. The ancient Jewish prophet Ezekiel 2500 years ago pre-wrote the events that would unfold in the last days. In the 38th chapter, he started in verse 2, he mentioned Gog in the land of Magog. Now Gog is the personality, Magog is the location. When you try to determine according to the Scriptures who these people would be, mentioned by these prophets, you can go back to the book of Genesis. In the 10th chapter of the book of Genesis, after the flood, God told Noah and his three sons, Shem, Ham and Japheth, to be fruitful, multiply and fill the earth; re-people the earth.

When you look at the first son mentioned in chapter 10 of Genesis, it’s Japheth. And one of his sons was Magog. He had others: Meshach Tubal, Gomer, Togarmah. And the Bible says in Genesis 5 these boys went to certain locations geographically. They established a nation, a language, they raised their families there.

Well, Magog went north of the Caspian and Black Sea to what we know today as modern-day Russia. So when you go back to Ezekiel 38, we’re talking about modern-day Russia as Magog. Meshach Tubal, Gomer, Togarmah, grandsons of Noah, sons of Japheth; they went into the area that we know as modern-day Turkey. You come down to the 5th verse in Ezekiel 38, you look at the word Persia, the first nation or group of peoples mentioned in verse 5 there. Until 1936, Persia was known as the name of what we know today as three different countries: Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran. And then when you follow, continuing through verse 5, it says in some translations of the Bible it talks about Cush or Ethiopia. Either way that’s referring to Ethiopia, Somalia, and Sudan. Then in verse 5, it concludes with either Put or Libya, and again that’s Libya. Colonel Kaddafi, there in the Western section of modern-day, or the location of the continent of Africa.

Those are some of the countries, but you can’t do a stand-alone in the book of Ezekiel chapter 38. Second Peter 1 says, “There’s no prophecy of private interpretation.” You can’t focus only on one passage; you’d have to bring in Daniel 11, starting in verses 40-45. It talks about the King of the North. And defined earlier in Daniel 11, that would be modern-day Syria. Then it refers to the King of the South; that would be modern-day Egypt. The Psalmist even brought some of the players to the table, as well. In Psalm 83 it mentions the Ishmaelites, and that’s exactly where Ishmael went to live, in Arabia; we know it today as Saudi Arabia. And then it also mentions in Psalm 83 Tyre, which is modern-day Lebanon. So, that would be the alignment of nations that are going to come against Israel in the last days. And again I mention the lowest common denominator, Islam, and the fundamental, radical aspect of Islam as well.

Ankerberg: Alright. So, we’re going to take a break and when we come back, we’re going to ask the question, do we see these countries that are mentioned in Ezekiel 38, are they preparing to come against Israel? And when we come back from the break, we’re going to hear again from the current prime minister of Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu, and what he says about the nuclear threat from Iran. You won’t want to miss this. Stick with us.

Ankerberg: Alright, we’re back. We’re talking with Dr. Jimmy DeYoung, and we’re talking about why is the world pulling its support away from Israel? Why are they abandoning Israel? And we had the privilege of sitting down with the prime minister of Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu, and he told us some stunning things about what Israel is facing. And I want you to hear what he has to say. And then I want Jimmy, who was sitting right next to me, I want him to explain how this fits in with biblical prophecy. In this next clip, you’re going to hear the prime minister of Israel talk about Iran’s development of nuclear weapons, how Iran wants to reestablish the Caliphate; how they’re trying to develop long-range ballistic missiles that will reach every European capital; and then how it will reach the United States within 10 years. Listen to this.

Netanyahu: The militant Sunnis have bombed New York, and have bombed Washington, and have bombed the other targets that al Qaeda has bombed from Bali to the European capitals. The militant Shiites in Iran are openly racing, and boasting that they’re racing to develop nuclear weapons with the explicit announced goal of wiping Israel from the face of the earth; re-establishing the Caliphate, of course under militant Shiite Iranian rule – the Caliphate includes the territories from Iran to Spain; developing long-range ballistic missiles first that are targeted to every European capital and within a decade to reach the eastern coast of the American mainland.

Ankerberg: Jimmy, it’s not you and me that are saying this; this is the prime minister of Israel. We’re going to hear from other government leaders in a little bit. But the fact is, these are real threats that Israel is facing.

DeYoung: What Benjamin Netanyahu said, let’s just rehearse it again: he said that the European continent is going to be under threat from these Iranian nuclear weapons of mass destruction. And someplace out in the future, the United States as well will become a target for what the Iranians want to do. Netanyahu told me personally, the day he made those comments that we just were able to view, and he said to me that, “I’ve got to deal with the Iranian threat.” In his inaugural address, when he was sworn in as prime minister of Israel, he said, “The number one issue in my administration has to be dealing with the Iranian threat.” And, in fact, when the United States came back and said we’re not going to assist the Israeli government or the Israeli Defense Force in dealing with the Iranian threat, Benjamin Netanyahu said, “Then we’ll do it alone. Somebody has to deal with Iran and this development of a nuclear weapon of mass destruction.” In fact, there are several red lines we may want to talk about that will give them the “Go” signal to go in and deal with it.

What’s going to happen, John, if indeed the Israeli Defense Force goes in there to take out this nuclear development program of Iran, it’s going to shake up the entire Middle East. It’s going to scare the people of the Middle East that the conflict is going to spread. That seems to be the indication of what Bible prophecy is telling us in Ezekiel 38:5. Again, I mentioned earlier, Persia is what we know today as modern-day Iran. And if the Israelis go in there under the threat that Ahmadinejad, the president of the country, has already said, “We’re going to wipe Israel off the face of the earth.” In fact, I read on the internet just the other day that Ahmadinejad said, “We’re not concerned about the threat. Israel is a non-entity. They’re not going to be able to deal with us. Nobody would come after us.” Well, if the Israelis go in, they’ll shake up the entire Middle East, they’ll shake up the world. And that’s why these world governments, the European Union, they want peace. United States, all we’re talking about is peace; let’s get along with everybody, especially the militant Muslim world. They don’t want this to happen, that’s why they’re pulling away from support to Israel.

Ankerberg: Alright, Jimmy, I want to talk about Admiral Mike Mullen, who is the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. And he was interviewed on ABC and he was asked the question, Does Iran have enough fissile material to make a bomb? And he said this, now listen, “We think they do, quite frankly. And Iran having a nuclear weapon, I’ve believed for a long time, is a very, very bad outcome for the region and for the world.” Then you have General David Petraeus, the top U.S. army commander in the Middle East, just told Congress, “Israel may ultimately see itself so threatened by the prospect of an Iranian nuclear weapon that it will take preemptive military action to derail or delay it.” Now, these threats to Israel are very, very real. Our top people in our government, in the military, are saying these threats are real. Now, we’ve mentioned the fact that Israel said they would attack Iran if two lines in the sand were crossed. They call them red lines, okay; you step across that line, you’ve gone too far, we’re going to attack. What are those two red lines?

DeYoung: John, the two red lines you’re talking about, the first one would be what Russia is going to do as it relates to their agreement to sell to Iran an air defense system that basically would shut down any attack that Israel might want to follow through with. The fact is that they have not transferred that equipment into Iran yet. There’s talk going on between the Israeli leaders, the Russian leaders, even the United States got involved with that. But we don’t know exactly how that’s going to play out. Probably, most likely, Russia will give, will deliver that air defense system to Iran. That’s the first red line, because if they get that in place, Israel will not be able to attack. The second red line, and Israeli intelligence is estimating that in the year 2009, Iran could be up and operating with at least one nuclear weapon of mass destruction. When the head of the Israeli intelligence community tells the prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, that Iran is ready to build that first bomb, they’re not going to allow Iran to have that bomb. They’re going to have to go in and take out this nuclear development program before that happens. Those are the two red lines, and if Iran crosses those two red lines, it’s an automatic go, the command is given. They have been preparing, by the way; they are ready to go any moment.

Ankerberg: Not only that, Jimmy, but when we were with him, he said when that order comes down, there is no disagreement in the government about what they have to do. Folks, I want you to listen to what he had to say.

Netanyahu: I think we have to do everything in our power to prevent the arming of Iran with nuclear weapons. On this, I have to say, there is absolute unanimity in Israel. There is no opposition, there is no coalition, not only on the declaratory level but on every other level. There are no party lines on this and there are no party divisions on this. I think this is a growing consensus. It wasn’t always the case. The clarity of this threat wasn’t always understood, but it is understood now and we have absolute unanimity on this. And I can say that in some of the leading governments of the world right now, there is equally a growing consensus. I think in most Arab governments today, and I’m weighing my words carefully by saying “most,” there is a fear that they, too, will be overtaken by the rising power of militant Islam. And, of course, the arming of Iran with nuclear weapons would tremendously increase that power, and thereby threaten not merely Israel but every Arab regime in the Middle East.

Ankerberg: Frankly, Jimmy, I was not expecting that answer. There is no disagreement, there are no factions, there is no squabble up and down in terms of the government. Why is Israel as a whole so intent on dealing with this problem?

DeYoung: John, they live with it, day in day out, 24/7. The United States and the leadership here can say, “We don’t have to worry about Iran; we’ll go and talk with them.” The European Union leaders can say, “We’ll apply sanctions. Though they may be a threat in the future, they’re not today.” Not one person ever in the world has said “we’re going to wipe Europe off the face of the earth, or the United States off the face of the earth.” But the president of Iran has over and over again said “We’re going to wipe the nation of Israel off the face of the earth, that their name be forgotten forever.” By the way, that’s a verse in Psalm 83, almost an exact quote that the president of Iran made. But when you live under that threat, how do you start to talk with somebody? Where do you start a conversation? How do you deal with a man, a madman, who is telling the world, “We’re going to wipe that nation off the face of the earth”? So they’re living with it on a daily basis. But the bottom line is, it is going to happen, because, not you and I make the statement it’s going to happen, even not Benjamin Netanyahu, the prime minister of Israel, is absolute on his statement. But God’s Word is absolute. It says, again I want to remind you, Persia in verse 5 of chapter 38 of the book of Ezekiel is modern-day Iran, and they’re going to be a part of the coalition of nations that are going to come to destroy the Jewish state in the last days.

Ankerberg: Alright, next week we’re going to continue this and we’re going to talk about the alignment of nations that are coming. And we’re going to talk about the other countries that Ezekiel mentioned. But we can’t get away from the central question we raised today, and that would be, what if the unthinkable happens? What if Iran actually does develop and gain a nuclear weapon? What would the world be like if the unthinkable happened, namely, there was a nuclear attack, a nuclear exchange? Jimmy, do you realize there are military people in our government that have already written out and given us an estimate of the statistics of the people that would be lost and the countries that would be involved? We’re going to hear again from the prime minister of Israel, we’re going to hear from the speaker of the Knesset, and we’re going to hear these quotes from our own governmental leaders as to what we might be facing in the short distance up ahead. Folks, you won’t want to miss this. I hope that you’ll join us.